I had a terrible night. My friend’s mother has died in a huge blast rocked my neighborhood and killed more than 12 people and wounded dozens last night. I’ll write about everything later but for now, I feel so sad and desperate. It was so hard to see her dead. She was a kind woman. I just saw her few days ago when I was with her son.
My heart is full of sorrow and pain. My friend had a horrible night searching for her in the hospitals by the time the city was all in darkness due to the lack of electricity.
I can’t even think of any hope at the meantime. It is only despair that hovers over us. It seems it is going to stick with us. I don’t know why we have to live like this. Why do I have to wake up everyday on sounds of explosions and shootings? Why do I have to be afraid all the time, why do I have to sleep and wake up with a tear in my eyes? why why why? I don’t want democracy and freedom. I want to live. I just want to live. These two damn words brought only destructions. They never brought hope. It is only death and death and death. I don’t want them…. take them and give us back the normal life. I wish I could change the time to the past.
My heart is full of sorrow and pain. My friend had a horrible night searching for her in the hospitals by the time the city was all in darkness due to the lack of electricity.
I can’t even think of any hope at the meantime. It is only despair that hovers over us. It seems it is going to stick with us. I don’t know why we have to live like this. Why do I have to wake up everyday on sounds of explosions and shootings? Why do I have to be afraid all the time, why do I have to sleep and wake up with a tear in my eyes? why why why? I don’t want democracy and freedom. I want to live. I just want to live. These two damn words brought only destructions. They never brought hope. It is only death and death and death. I don’t want them…. take them and give us back the normal life. I wish I could change the time to the past.
Ok- we will pull out and allow your Islamist crocdiles to take over. Is that what you want? As I said before- start ACTUALLY helping the coalition and your new government and things will change. If your people won't rat on the militants crawling around your countryside then you can expect more bloodshed. It's the militants that are deliberately trying to incite civil war, not us. If you won't help the coalition defeat the f*cking bastards then you can look forward to a Taliban style regime that will make your lives a living hell. Your call mate...
ReplyDeleteDemocracy comes at a price. It's the reason why 50 million people died fighting the likes of Hitler, Mussolini and Tojo. They died to stop facist bastards from turning the world into a living hell.
Anonymous said...
ReplyDeleteOk- we will pull out and allow your Islamist crocdiles to take over. Is that what you want? As I said before- start ACTUALLY helping the coalition and your new government and things will change. If your people won't rat on the militants crawling around your countryside then you can expect more bloodshed. It's the militants that are deliberately trying to incite civil war, not us. If you won't help the coalition defeat the f*cking bastards then you can look forward to a Taliban style regime that will make your lives a living hell. Your call mate...
Democracy comes at a price. It's the reason why 50 million people died fighting the likes of Hitler, Mussolini and Tojo. They died to stop facist bastards from turning the world into a living hell.
Aren’t you ashamed of yourself? And you say it? Did you forget that you are the ones who brought these “Islamist crocodiles”? Were they in Iraq before you polluted and destroyed our land? SHAME ON YOU. SHAME ON YOU. SHAME ON YOU.
ReplyDeleteYes, GET THE HELL OUT OF HERE. WE DON’T WANT YOU HERE. YOU DESTROYED OUR COUNTRY. SHAMEFUL SHAMFUL SHAMEFUL… OUUUUUUUUUUUTTTTTTT.
Yes, Anonymous, your comment was a fine example in tact, common courtesy and compassion.
ReplyDeleteSo let me put it in easy words: Fuck off and keep your comment for another time when BT is discussing politics and not personal loss!!
I don't know what to say, BT. I was really sorry to read your post.
Like so many people I just want those killings to stop.
Did you forget that you are the ones who brought these “Islamist crocodiles”? Were they in Iraq before you polluted and destroyed our land?
ReplyDelete...................................
In that case we will release Saddam and he can continue is benevolent rule if that is ok by you. In case you missed it the Islamists are only in Iraq for one reason- to prevent Iraq becoming a democracy thus defeating the West's aim of empowering the people of the middle east- who I might add are living under a bunch of self serving tyrants and dictators. If muslims hate democracy so much can you please tell them to stop fleeing to our shores and fight their own internal battles themselves. We are getting sick of being the punching bag for all the muslim worlds ills, the shitty regimes and appalling bestial behaviour.
You bastards have no hearts.
ReplyDeleteCan't you see BT is grieving?
Can't you even afford the dead some dignity and piece?
HAVE SOME HUMAN COMPASSION.
BT, habibi, ina lil allah wina ilahi raji3oun.
My deepest condolences.
Your brothers and sisters are here for you.
BT, can Iraq only be controlled by force? I can't read you and 24 Steps and even TAI and Nadia and think your future is to be enslaved again. Just stay safe, OK? And godspeed to your police & army in reigning in your enemies.
ReplyDelete“If muslims hate democracy so much can you please tell them to stop fleeing to our shores and fight their own internal battles themselves.”
ReplyDeleteWell, ask your troops to stop killing innocents and stop occupying and invading countries. By then, you can open your mouth and speak. Eye for eye. You are shameful from head to toe. Muslims never called you for democracy. Stop performing the role of the “good”. This play is no longer being watched.
“We are getting sick of being the punching bag for all the muslim worlds ills, the shitty regimes and appalling bestial behaviour.”
We are sick of you and your troops. don’t forget the innocent families you killed in Iraq. HADEETHA, ABU GHRAIB, BUCCA, ETC… will never be forgotten and you should be always embarrassed. We trusted you but you let us down. Shame on you. I will say this until I die honorably in my country, not in a country I occupied. You know what I mean!
OUUUUUUUTTTTTT
You bastards have no hearts.
ReplyDeleteCan't you see BT is grieving?
Can't you even afford the dead some dignity and piece?
HAVE SOME HUMAN COMPASSION.
BT, habibi, ina lil allah wina ilahi raji3oun.
My deepest condolences.
Your brothers and sisters are here for you.
...................................
When I see the same compassion coming from muslims towards US families who have lost sons and daughters who gave their lives so that Iraq could be a free and independant nation I will oblique. Until then, I will reserve my compassion to those that FIGHT, truely FIGHT for their own nation. In the West every single country had bloody internal struggles so that men may live free from absolute tyranny. If Iraqi's want freedom and an end to incessant dictators, then FIGHT for it. The West can only do so much...
American soldiers want to live to. And yet they fight the criminals and Americans die...and for what? So they can save a dollar on gas? so they don't have to pay off a college loan? Are things things to give your life for? No, They fight because they have hope for your children to someday know peace and freedom. Peace is not the absence of conflict, it is the presence of justice and freedom. Everywhere there is freedom, there were first those who did not fear death more than what is right. Unless a seed falls to the ground and dies it can have no fruit.
ReplyDeleteI am sorry for your losses. Before you judge what I have said, know that I have lost a loved one too. But there is a greater tradgedy than death alone...and that is death without meaning. I want to live too...but if I must live, let it be for something. If I must die, let it also be for something. So what shall I owe my life to, the criminals or to freedom? In the end, we are all judged for what we lived and for what we died. It is not for our lives, it is for the children that they might one day know neither war nor oppression but freedom only, and peace.
“When I see the same compassion coming from muslims towards US families who have lost sons and daughters who gave their lives so that Iraq could be a free and independant nation I will oblique.”
ReplyDeleteAren’t you really ashmed of youreslf? If you are so honest and love your country, why wouldn’t you identify yourself first instead of being anonymous? Secondly, everyone knows that most Iraqis, not all, felt sad for the lives of the civilians who died in 911. but talking about losing sons and daughters in Iraq?!!!!!! When I see the same compassion coming from the Americans towards the families who were killed in cold blood by the US marines in Hadeetha, and the abuse of Abu Ghraib prisoners….
And wait a second, do you really believe in all these fake slogans of freedom and democracy? Which freedom are you talking about? The tyranny of the militias your troops brought from Iran with Hakim? TELL ME TELL ME TELL ME.
NO ONE BELIEVES IN THESE FAKE SLOGANS ANY MORE. WE ARE NOT FOOLS. Go and read blogs of other Iraqis who live in Iraq and tell me how they believe in you “honest and good” role in bringing “freedom and democracy”……
OUUUUUUUUUUUUUTTTTTTTT
HADEETHA, ABU GHRAIB, BUCCA, ETC… will never be forgotten and you should be always embarrassed.
ReplyDelete...................................
Baghdad- of course we should be embarrased. When you have over a quarter of a million troops you are bound to have some 'animals' in the mix. Nothing the US has done can possibly equal the muslim world for sheer butchery- even on your own kind. Fishing out headless 10 years olds from rivers and slaughtering young men in heidious inventive ways is YOUR crime, not ours. As an Iraqi reporter, WHY are you not challenging the butchers that are killing your own people by the bushell? Nah, it's better to kick the infidel occupier instead, isn't it,huh? Just about in every muslim land there is butchery, intolerance,and medievil behaviour not witnessed since the Spanish Inquistion years. The entire muslim world needs a bloody good shake-up. Teachers being slaughtered in front of their families for teaching girls. 14 years old girls been hunted down like dogs and killed to slate a families thirst for honour. Regimes hanging teenagers for being 'gay'. Beheading and suicide bombing is now becoming a way of life and is being taught to young children as been acceptable alternatives in settling differences. Prove me wrong Baghdad...Wafa Sultan is in hiding because she had the gall to SPELL it out to the world what the Islamic world has become. The do-gooders will only tell you what you want to hear. If you want that then I cannot help you see another reality to what is occurring to your country.......in the eyes of this and other 'infidels' that is.
“It is not for our lives, it is for the children that they might one day know neither war nor oppression but freedom only, and peace.”
ReplyDeleteWhy??? I am a human being. I have the right to live. We’ve been struggling for years. What is the change? When I live, I can do everything for the sake of my country because I am going to work and produce. Now, I can’t do anything. I want to live to serve my country. Living in peace does not mean doing nothing.
BT...I am an american...I have no political speeches, I only have this to say:
ReplyDeleteI weep for you loss. It pains my heart to hear your pain. I feel helpless, and wish I knew how to relieve you even a small amount of your sorrows if it were possible. I will say no more, but pray for peace in your heart and healing your land.
Baghdad Treasure- is there any way you can start a protest movement against the Insurgents? They are the ones that are causing the deaths and preventing security and calm. People need to give these killers a powerful message. In my country I watched a program on Iraqi policemen. The Americans are training 3,000 per induction and their survival outcome is only 90 days. That is heartbreaking- your people need to morally support your recruits and help the coalition defeat the insurgents. It's the only way you and your family are ever going to get peace. The US is not the only country that has troops in Iraq. What about the British? The Australians? Do you really think we want to be over there occupying another country forever? The sooner we get the Iraq army and police STRONG the better. Once they can secure the country we can go home.
ReplyDeleteMy deepest ta'azee. Allah yirhamha.
ReplyDeleteBT- "When I live, I can do everything for the sake of my country because I am going to work and produce"
ReplyDeleteBut how can you produce without security, how can people build if it will only be later blown up? Who's iraq will be built in the next 10 years...zarqawi's, or the people's Iraq? For every person who has sacrificed, there are 10 that produce in the peace, security and freedom that was given to them by the sacrifice. I agree that you can do much by going to work and producing for your country, I honor both you who help with how you live and those who sacrifice to try and make it better somehow for you to do so, even if it is yet in the future. I honor them because, they did not die to bring criminals to your country, even if the criminals were not there before. They did not die to destroy your land. They died because they have hope that you will someday, (and oh how I pray that this would come true) that someday you may produce a greater, more beautiful Iraq, in peace and freedom, without war, without oppression from a sadam or al zarqawi, but a country that you, and your fellow citizens can build for each other. If such a day will come (and I dream of it for you) then in that day perhaps, after the bloodshed, and after the hoplessness has departed, in that day, Americans and Iraqis may both say of their dead: I honor you for the price you gave, you are not forgotten. And may the beauty of Iraq's tomorrow grow from the seeds that have fallen today, and how I hope it is a more beautiful Iraq than can even be imagined. A seed may die, but the life it brings after conquers even it's own death. All wars must someday end, for Death is not the strongest of powers, life conquers all. And for your loss, even though they for a moment knew death, as we all must, yet they now know life and paradise, because life is stronger, even if it is hard to see in so much death. I pray for life in Iraq.
If That Girl Picks Up a Book - Kill Her
ReplyDeleteWords fail me. Human garbage. Rock bottom.
Suspected Taliban militants have beheaded a headteacher in central Afghanistan, the latest in a string of gruesome attacks on teachers working in schools where girls are taught. Armed men burst into the home of Malim Abdul Habib in Qalat, the capital of restive Zabul province, on Tuesday night. They dragged him into a courtyard and forced his family to watch as they cut off his head, said Ali Khel, a local government spokesman...Hundreds of students attended his funeral yesterday. "Only the Taliban are against our girls being educated," Mr Khel said.
Well there - that's why they're human garbage. They dedicate their lives to preventing girls from getting an education - what a noble goal! What a splendid way for grown men to spend their time - zipping around the countryside with guns murdering teachers who have the gall to teach girls - and making the family watch is a pretty touch, too.
The Taliban insurgency has taken a brutal twist in the past year with militants avoiding shoot-outs with American troops - which they usually lose - in favour of targeted assassinations of teachers, aid workers and pro-government clerics. Last month gunmen pulled a teacher in Helmand province from his classroom and shot him at the school gate after he ignored orders to stop teaching girls. The violent tactics, which are concentrated in the southern provinces where a British-led Nato force is due to assume control next spring, appear to be working. Nabi Khushal, the director of education in Zabul, told the Associated Press that 100 of the province's 170 registered schools had been closed over the past two years, mostly in remote areas, due to deteriorating security. Only 8% of the pupils are girls, he said.
100 out of 170. Well how nice. One of the poorest countries on earth, and the schools are closing because men who hate all females are killing people. Spiffy. It's enough to make you sick.
THIS IS WHAT THE IRAQI PEOPLE CAN LOOK FORWARD TOO IF THE US COALITION FAILS THEIR MISSION.
You know...there is a real simple solution to getting the Americans "OUUUTTTTTTT" as you say...
ReplyDeleteJust start spreading the word for people to call for a national referendum on the presence of American soldiers in Iraq. When enough people demand it of the politicians, they will hold a national vote. And then people can vote yes or no to the american presence, with the very powers of democracy that America brought to Iraq. If most Iraqi's think as you do, then this should be very easy right? But if it is not such an easy thing, then perhaps not everyone agrees with "OUUUTTTT"
This seems to me like a simple solution.
This is, and always will be, the difference between us and you.
ReplyDeleteThey kill...and we fight them.
They kill...and you always blame us.
If you would have fought them before, we would not have to fight them now. If you say you had no power to fight them before, fine, but now that you do, you instead blame us. I am tired of your slogans too.
The killers see us as the enemy. The killers are happy with you.
They take your friends and smile at your blog.
They take your friends but we are not happy with their death. They take our sons and you blame us.
we will always be against the killers. They will always be against us.
Always.
“They kill...and you always blame us.”
ReplyDeleteWHAAAAAAAAAAAT? Who killed the hundred innocents and said it happened “by mistake”? did they?
Who killed the family in Haditha in cold blood? Did they?
Who killed the prisoners in Abu Ghraib after being tortured? Did they?
BE ASHAMED ALL OF YOUR LIFE. YOU WILL ALWAYS BE CONSIDERED MURDERERS, NOT LIBERATORS.
LIBERATORS DO NOT DO WHAT YOU DID IN IRAQ. YOU DESTROYED IRAQ.
CONFESS IT. DO NOT DENY IT. YOU ALSO KILLED AND KILLED MANY, NOT A FEW!
BE ASHAMED ALL OF YOUR LIFE. YOU WILL ALWAYS BE CONSIDERED MURDERERS, NOT LIBERATORS.
ReplyDeleteLIBERATORS DO NOT DO WHAT YOU DID IN IRAQ. YOU DESTROYED IRAQ.
CONFESS IT. DO NOT DENY IT. YOU ALSO KILLED AND KILLED MANY, NOT A FEW!
...................................
BaghdadTreasure:
Those incidents where caused by individuals who were out of control. It was never the intention of the coalition for things to go so badly wrong. Again I ask you- why are you only concentrating on US crimes? Why are you not railing against the inhuman insurgent behaviour against you own people? Is it a case of your attacking the coalition is easier and more popularist than examining the extreme ills of your own? Or is it that you are too afraid to challenge the killers that dwell in your midst? If we pull out you know what will happen, so be careful what you wish for. There was a poster here that said to get your government to hold a referendum- why don't you do that? That way the onus will be on you people to decide if we stay or not. If we are not wanted at least we can leave in the knowledge that it was you that decided your own fate- whatever that may be.
CAN YOU NOT SEE THE DIFFERENCE???
ReplyDeleteWhen we find such evidence of Abu Graihb, etc, we throw those criminals in jail to rot. Sadam, zarqawi...they would give such soldiers great honor!
Do you not think that if we desired to murder so much, we could wipe out everything? We could be like hitler? or Stalin? and move everyone to camps for work or extermination?
We Hate Murder! And I tell you, as these investigtions continue, on Haditha, and Bucca, that if we can prove these things, they will rot in jail. Even Zacharious Moussoui who recently pleaded guilty conspiring with 9/11 said, after he did not get the death sentence, that he now believes he can get a fair trial by americans. And he believed in 9/11! We are not murderes. If you want to blame us for not being successful at trying to help you, that is one thing, but MURDERERS? You spit on the grave of every american who died to help you by saying such a thing. What do you think, we are just trying to find ways to kill you all and get away with it??? You have no Idea what goes on in the heart of an American if you say such things. It is so incredible all the time to hear such statements for anyone who is here in America, because we know so much what we wish for, why we send our sons to die, and what we believe...and I can tell you this, NONE OF US DESIRES MURDER.
I will not put you in the same side as the criminals. They are murdurers. I will not blame you for thier crimes because that would be absurd to say everyone there is the same. Do not do the same to us.
There is only one enemy. One. It is the criminals. Americans will one day go home...but the criminals will not. The criminals are murderes and must be destroyed.
To Baghdad Treasure:
ReplyDeleteThis article is 6 pages long, when you have some time please read it carefully and give us your thoughts.
http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200512/iraq-army
you know...here in America, if we have a loved one in the hospital, we'd probably be on the doctors case for every little thing, and if the doctor messed up, we'd sue him for malpractice. It doesn't matter that the doctor desired to help, all that mattered are the results. This issue won't be resolved until iraq sees better times, and if the usa can win this war, Iraqi's will remember them well. I suspect there is a feeling of helplessness and it's easy to blame it on America because they had such high hopes. We just need to win and bring stability, thats the solution.
ReplyDeleteHard to win when the people who you are trying to help don't even support your trying to help them though. I say let them fight the insurgents and die for their own country, and if they get stuck with another oppressive murderous dictator, they only have themselves to blame. You can help build some peoples countries (Japan, Germnay South Korea) and some you can not (Vietnam, Iraq). They keep giving comfort to the enemy. it's time to bring the soldiers home.
ReplyDeleteThats what they want, for the americans to leave so that they can take advantage of their own people and set up another oppressive system. It's greed and power. They want America out so that they can oppress the women, treat their political and religious opponents like crap and use it for personal gain. Of course they are gonna say horrible things about Americans, they can't wait to take advantage of everything at the expense of the helpless. Americans are needs to stay to help those who can't help themselves.
ReplyDeleteThe posters who suggested a referendum are correct.
ReplyDeleteLet the people of iraq vote if the Americans should stay or leave.
BT-Use your blog to call on the people to request a national vote. Iraq belongs to it's people. Let them decide their fate.
Sadly, there would be no need for such a "referendum" had the elections in Iraq recently actually been fair and democratic (I don't consider having to choose between a small number of people who were hand picked by a foreign power to be a truly democratic election).
ReplyDeleteBT please take care of yourself. I've seen you getting more and more upset in recent weeks... know that your readers worry about you man. Be careful.
My sincerest condolences to your friend and his family. I pray that there is a way out of this mess.
anon 2.23 you wrote "if the usa can win this war"
ReplyDeleteIraqis don't need your war. Take your war of terror to the US mainland.
Honestly US people who are for this damn war of terror are such a coward bunch of people. Take your damn war to your mainland and see how it feels when over 100 000 US people have died.
ReplyDeleteGET OUT OF IRAQ; YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO SCARIFY IRAQIS.
Nadia you scarify CAPS! All the font is in full ridicule.
ReplyDelete/shaking the wag finger..
Nadia,
ReplyDeleteHow many people died on Saddam's orders? Did you forget what it was like with him in power or were you and your family in a position where you had nothing to fear from Saddam and his henchmen? Oh but wait, even his own family wasn't free from being put on his "hit list" were they? "Scarify" Iraqis? Did you mean sacrifice Iraqis? I'm beginning to agree that the MNF should leave. I don't think that they should be sacrificing their lives for people that have proven that they are unable to help themselves or show any appreciation for the sacrifices of those who wanted to give them some hope for a future.
How are americans supposed to take this war out of iraq as you suggest? There are two sides to every war, if america go's home, do you think the other side will too? No! Instead they will take over, and rule you with much more death than they try to use now, the only difference is, it will be the kind of death where people dissapear only to be found in mass graves in the desert. America leaving will not send the criminals home too, the onlr road to peace is to defeat the criminals.
ReplyDeleteThe US will not be able to "win" this war because they lack the empathy of the Iraqi people. In destroying the initial enemy, they have now become the enemy. The military is too blind and proud to realize that in order for the iraqi people to start healing, the US must now "lose".
ReplyDeleteAnonymous, you are a freak. As BaghdadTreasure said: "Get out and F off!!!"
ReplyDeleteBT: Wa a3rid 3an al Jahileen.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous is a freak who is too coward to leave us his/her name.
BT-
ReplyDeleteI am sorry for the loss. I am sorry for every innocent life, Iraqi, American, human being's life who is lost in war. Its ugly and nobody could honestly like war. I am a supporter of Bush and the effort, and hope you can understand that there are decent people here that care about the Iraqi citizens. We want our troops to come home as soon as possible. Unfortunately, spreading democracy, building schools and hospitals in Iraq all come second. The mission is a global conflict with terror. Regardless if you would agree this involves Iraq, please understand our soldiers are not murderers. Most are scared kids who are thrown into the most complicated, lonely experience of their lives. They were not sent there to kill innocent people. Thats not what Americans do. Democracy is a beautiful thing, and sure, it may not be able to thrive everywhere. It thrives in the USA. We will do anything and everything to defend freedom and democracy. There is always a second war going on with people in this country opposing it. Its freedom at its best, everyone has a voice. I love this country, and I'd be damned if anyone ever tries to steal my freedom.
BT-
ReplyDeleteI needed to ask you your thoughts about why the USA invaded Baghdad. I have never talked to a non-American about this and this site is very interesting to me. I am sure you are aware that in America there are popular oppositions to the war such as oil, GW finishing Dad's work, and false pretences of weapons of mass-murder. Its very hard, or better yet impossible, for me to put myself in your situation. I want to know if you and your loved ones are happy that Sadaam is out of power. I am sure its complete chaos over there, but do you truly believe the US is there for anything other than to disrupt extremist activities by knocking out the largest and strongest threat in the Middle East? I just don't see the logic, and I want to be enlightened. The USA could have demolished Iraq in a two-hour air strike and left nothing but a bloody mess of rubble. Instead we hit strategic targets aimed at dismantling the government. The tyrant is out, fine, but the goal is to ensure America is safe. People lose sight that that is why we are there. We are not there to rule Iraqis. We ARE pushing democracy, but it is not for your benefit. We are a superpower because we've realized democracies have too much at stake to focus on destroying others. Democracies are focused on strengthening their economy, free trade, and educating the next generation. The fact that Iraqis benefit (in my opinion) from this process is great, but its a side benefit.You may not want to become like us Americans. Fine. There are millions of peopl within our borders who don't want to be Americans. Its their choice. At the sime time, however, I DO want to be part of this great country, and I will not let anyone take it from me because I don't maintain their belief system. We, those of us in the USA that understand there is a global movement in process to kill every last one of us, just want to secure these unstable regions that would blow us off the planet if they are allowed to operate without consequence. I for one believe Iraq and Sadaam were a risk, and one we simply cannot take. Others will disagree, but we're not at war with Iraq. We are at war with this fundamentalist movement, wherever it may lie. And as Americans, I can guarantee you that if negotiating for peace was possible, we would be sitting at the table. Unfortunately, those that truly want to overtake your country would blow that table up. There is no ill will toward Muslims, and I feel awful, and embarrased for humankind, that terrorists would wage a war in God's name. If you were born in the USA and truly loved this land, you would see that war was declared on us, and our enemy will do everything until we disarm him. There is no other solution. I am truly sorry about the casualties in Iraq, but please trust me on this...Americans, democrat or republican, value life more than anything else in the world. Our enemy knows that, and is using it to exploit us. NO ONE here wants this war, and I am sickened that, for my children's sake, it needs to be fought. America is always under scrutiny and criticism from the rest of the world. I used to be bothered by this, but its never going to go away, no matter what we do as a people. Its the downside of the role we are continually forced to play on this planet, and it is always changing. I hope the good people of Iraq can be our allies and work together to fight this war and give our children a future.
hi misdirected hostility,
ReplyDeletethanks for sparing all this time to ask me what i feel about iraq. i have stated my concept of the war against my beloved country in several previous posts and comments on my blog and the others'.
Anyway, i would love to tell you about it again. would you mind emailing me in order to get your email address and we can discuss these issues again.
Thank you.
[misdirected hostility] “We, those of us in the USA that understand there is a global movement in process to kill every last one of us, just want to secure these unstable regions that would blow us off the planet if they are allowed to operate without consequence. I for one believe Iraq and Sadaam were a risk, and one we simply cannot take. Others will disagree, but we're not at war with Iraq. We are at war with this fundamentalist movement, wherever it may lie.”
ReplyDeleteMay I suggest that you understand wrongly. Or rather, you misunderstand the scale of the ‘global movement’ and what drives it. And this misunderstanding is not accidental, it is created on purpose by your government.
Al Qaeda is a scattered and numerically small movement. Its driving force is dual: to establish Islamic states and to fight American secularism. Most Muslims are uninterested in theocratic rule a la Iran. This makes them impervious to Al Qaeda’s message.
So, it needs another tack.
That’s where you come in.
By seizing on American support for secular dictators and American interventionism as a casus belli (incidentally legitimate concerns) Al Qaeda has tried to popularize their cause. And they are helped greatly when the US takes offensive action against Muslim countries, because then their message is justified. “See! The infidel Americans are trying to destroy Islam by force! They want to destroy our people! Look at the way they have attacked the innocent Iraqis!”
The irony of course is, bin Laden hated Hussein and in fact wanted to lead mujaheddin to Kuwait to fight him himself. The further irony is that Hussein was really good at eliminating religious fundamentalists of every stripe, because they posed a threat to him. So, by taking out Hussein, the US did Al Qaeda a great favour. Not only was an obstacle to AQ infiltration and ideas removed, but a legitimate casus belli against America – ie – aggression against the Muslim Iraqi people was created. In other words, AQ are setting themselves up to be the “good guys”.
However, America needs Al Qaeda.
Or, more specifically, those Americans that want to expand American hegemony into a lasting global empire need Al Qaeda. They need an enemy to fight against and to legitimize ongoing interventions in critically important geostrategic areas. They need you to believe that Al Qaeda is a genuine danger to the West, when this idea is patently absurd, since they don’t have the numbers, weapons or support to make this possible.
American leaders – scratch that – American imperialists who prey on US electoral ignorance on US foreign policy – have other goals in mind, which far exceed the elimination of a scattered rabble like AQ.
They recognize that the oil is running out fast. They recognize that China is not only going to be the ‘next big rival’ for the US, but that China is critically dependent on oil to keep its economy going. As we all are. The people that say the US is in Iraq for cheap oil are correct, but only in a limited simplistic manner. Cheap oil is not as important as control of the oil supply. Such control gives one enormous leverage to destroy other countries’ economies, if they step out of line. It removes other countries’ ability to wage war, against the US at least. So oil control can be seen as a proxy for violent force projection, and a much cheaper, bloodless proxy at that. Oil control is de facto control of the global economy. Oil control is the maintaining of “dollar hegemony”.
Thus we have a convergence of interests. AQ needs America to legitimize and popularize itself amongst Muslims. American imperialists need AQ as a casus belli for legitimizing their expanding zone of control. All the babble from both sides about Hussein, democracy, freedom and destroying Islam is rubbish, it is a smokescreen for far greater ambitions.
My fear is that through stoking the fires as per the invasion of Iraq, America is not only popularizing Al Qaeda, but also tarnishing the ideals which have been used as a sauce to make this war palatable to Americans – democracy, freedom and self rule. I believe that Americans are not a majority of imperialists. I believe that if Americans understand the deeper reasons driving this conflict they will realize that they are playing into AQ’s hands. I believe that if America works with Muslim moderates, instead of invading their countries and radicalizing them, Al Qaeda is entirely finished.
BT - feel free to correct me on any misrepresentations I may have made. :)
"They need you to believe that Al Qaeda is a genuine danger to the West, when this idea is patently absurd, since they don’t have the numbers, weapons or support to make this possible."- Bruno
ReplyDeleteMaybe I'm playing into someones hand here, but the attacks on 9/11 consitute a genuine danger to me. It doesn't take numbers, weapons, or support to become a terrorist and destroy our way of life.
Radicals in any group are a danger to democracy. HOw do you even begin to deal with them? In the U.S. they aren't that dangerous, but look at the ones in the middle east. But the U.S. is too diverse to accomplish anything abroad.
Look at Iraq, now that is scary. They send their own to be suicide bombers, no wonder the U.S. military has valued Iraqi lives so little. What a shame!
What's wrong with these radicals? Will they ever stop, or is Bush right when he says they all must be killed?
It's really too bad that these terrorists hide behind the innocent people of Iraq. But as Bruno put it, this is a winning plan for them. But maybe this means that they are more sophisticated than we would believe.
It's obvious that they don't a democracy to spring in Iraq, but why? Democracy and Islam can go hand in hand. Don't they get this?
Who knows? It's a shitty world we live in. Anyone now a decent patch of land for sale in some nowhere land? I'm looking.
[bruno] "They need you to believe that Al Qaeda is a genuine danger to the West, when this idea is patently absurd, since they don’t have the numbers, weapons or support to make this possible."- Bruno
ReplyDelete[pd] “Maybe I'm playing into someones hand here, but the attacks on 9/11 consitute a genuine danger to me. It doesn't take numbers, weapons, or support to become a terrorist and destroy our way of life.”
Alright, let’s start by saying that for the purposes of argument, I concede that AQ is a serious threat.
Starting from that position, let’s examine in what way the Iraqi invasion has aided your fight against AQ.
You removed a dictator who used to liquidate the Al Qaedists and replaced him with a chaos. You antagonized millions of Iraqis who would have been quite happy to leave you alone. If we accept the US state department definition of the Iraqi Resistance as AQ-aligned terrorists, then what you have in fact done is created tens of thousands of terrorists (where none existed before) and worse, you have set up your troops to serve as target practice for them in a grinding war of attrition that, quite frankly, outside of genocide, you cannot win.
What I’m saying is, EVEN IF we fully buy into the US official line, this invasion has been a total, unmitigated disaster as far as the “war on terror” is concerned.
[pd] “It's obvious that they don't a democracy to spring in Iraq, but why? Democracy and Islam can go hand in hand. Don't they get this?”
*sigh* You see, that’s another reason why Americans were so easily fooled into going to war against Iraq. It’s because your average American has no clue about the complexities of Iraqi politics and divisions. I would say, of course Islam and democracy are compatible. But then the radicals would say WHICH Islam? Are you talking about the Sunni, Shia, Sufi, Wahhabi version? The same as Christianity, there are several versions. Not all of which are at peace with each other. And the US invasion went and blew the lid off the pressure cooker and worse, set the whole damn pot on fire.
Strictly speaking, the government in Iraq at the moment is Shia dominated, which is opposed to the violent brand of Salafism that AQ espouses. Of course, the fact that the groups currently collaborating with you are Iranian – aligned makes that hardly a reassuring prospect. As a reader on wars, I can assure you that the Shiites are historically quite, quite happy to sacrifice thousands of lives for a limited objective. If you think the “sunnis” are bad, heh-heh-heh, well, you ain’t seen nuthin’ yet.
In other words, the moment the collaborator Iraqis that are working with you think that they don’t need you anymore, you will be subjected to the same fight (but on a larger scale) you currently experience in the so called Sunni Triangle, throughout the rest of Iraq. The British are already getting the “hint”, and are scramming.
My point is: Iraq had nothing to do with AQ, but now it may well have. Worse, AQ is spending the blood of Iraqi nationalists who have nothing to do with it to popularize its cause. Worse still, those nationalists that are fighting you would have been fighting against AQ, before the invasion.
Do you understand now, that, EVEN IF we accept the rationalizations of your government, that this invasion is the most historic screw up since Vietnam?
bruno-
ReplyDeleteHow can you be sure its the "most historic screw up since Vietnam?" This thing just started, and if my recent history is correct, the point of this war is to disrupt terror cells and ensure weapons don't fall into the hands of irresponsible, dangerous people. The war is those who want freedom versus those who want to destroy it. AQ is a part of it, but so is every other radical fundamentalist conspiring to hurt the USA. I don't care why they hate the USA, and I don't want to change their minds. I just want to co-exist on the same planet without them plotting to blow me up. If this were possible, we would not be in Iraq.
There hasn't been an attack on the US since 9/11. Is it because the US is being proactive and dismantling terror networks? I don't know. I can't say either way. How can you say its a failure? Its too early.
If the USA is indeed responsible for bringing terrorists to Iraq, fine. Thats the idea. Our military is there and is wiping them out. The war is not within our borders. Everything GW said we would do, we're doing. Its different from Vietnam because we'll finish this time. We won the war in Nam, but lost because of the American public. The same people here are trying to do the same thing again, by tearing down the President, but its not working.
I don't blame Iraqi's for their feelings toward the USA, however, I do believe more of them are with us than against us. It just seems this hatred should be against the terrorists committing atrocities against innocent Iraqis. Even with the fear of bombs, brave Iraqis line up at police stations to be trained. They want these monsters eliminated also. They obviously love their country. What an idea, actually doing something about it, rather than sitting back bitching and blaming someone else.
Further, Sadaam was a terrorist. Mass-murder of the innocent qualifies. What was next? If he's allowed to have Kuwait then what? Israel too? If he gasses thousands of people, am I to believe he immediately destroyed his weapons stockpile after? He declared his contempt for the USA. What do you do??? Force, unfortunately, was the only way.
The USA will never win popular support in the Middle East. Thats too bad, but I would argue we're not fighting for acceptance. We love our way of life here. Its truly amazing how far one can make it in this country. Its why millions are trying to get across the border. We tried to sit back for far too long until our way of life was jeopardized.
Further, my government is not manipulating me, as you propose. I was witness to what my enemy is capable of. My plan would have already involved searching Syria for those weapons, and forcing sanctions on Iran. Enemies of the US know how to win the political war, and people here buy into it. I disagree with PLENTY that this President is doing, all in the name of politics...to ensure his base is not upset.
ReplyDeleteThe basic premise is simple. Right versus Wrong. You would disagree with what I consider "Right." Its an underlying moral stance that guides our life. We will disagree on base principles, but you sound like a very intelligent person, who I am sure I can learn a lot from. After all, I have never even been out of the USA!
Misdirected Hostility –
ReplyDeletePlease read my post again. You will see that I have already anticipated and answered your statement:
[MH] This thing just started, and if my recent history is correct, the point of this war is to disrupt terror cells and ensure weapons don't fall into the hands of irresponsible, dangerous people.
For the second time:
“If we accept the US state department definition of the Iraqi Resistance as AQ-aligned terrorists, then what you have in fact done is created tens of thousands of terrorists (where none existed before) and worse, you have set up your troops to serve as target practice for them in a grinding war of attrition that, quite frankly, outside of genocide, you cannot win.”
In other words you have CREATED opposition to you amongst the Iraqi people, who would have been quite happy, to, as you say: “co-exist on the same planet without them [the US in this case] plotting to blow me up.”
Quite how you can define this as progress is confusing to me.
[MH] “I don't blame Iraqi's for their feelings toward the USA, however, I do believe more of them are with us than against us.”
I’m afraid you are completely off track there. Facts are:
PIPA Poll 2006 (University of Maryland)
“Even larger majorities, including a majority of Kurds, indicate a readiness to follow the government’s lead should it choose to pursue a timetable. Asked if it was a good idea for Iraqi leaders to have agreed at the Arab League conference that there should be a timetable for the withdrawal of US-led forces from Iraq, 87% say that it was, including 64% of Kurds, 94% of Sunnis and 90% of Shia.
[…]
Overall, 47% [that’s about 12 million Iraqis] say they approve of “attacks on US-led forces” (23% strongly). There are huge differences between ethnic groups. An extraordinary 88% of Sunnis approve, with 77% approving strongly. Forty-one percent of Shia approve as well, but just 9% strongly. Even 16% of Kurds approve (8% strongly).” //end excerpt
I can also refer you to polls that indicate about 1% of Iraqis feel that the US contributes to their safety, and that a mere 10 or so % see you as “liberators”.
Iraqis are against you, irredeemably. Those are the facts.
[MH] “The basic premise is simple. Right versus Wrong. You would disagree with what I consider "Right."
Right is honesty to your own principles. It is not turning another people’s country into a battleground so that you can fight your enemies there. It is adherence to the conventions and laws to which one has agreed to, and not trying to play with definitions in order to subvert them. It is about keeping one’s word true. Right is not engaging in the hypocrisy of supporting one dictator while slamming another for being a dictator. Right is in carefully studying a situation to evaluate the consequences of failure, as opposed to assuming all will simply fall into place. It is about not stealing what is not yours, and not killing those who have done you no harm.
Yes, I think I understand what “right” means.
And I also understand that (through design or incompetence) you are fast losing whatever support and respect the moderate Muslim mainstream had for you. You are driving them into radicalism. You are setting up the “clash of civilisations” which everybody is talking about but does not exist yet.
Worse, you are losing Europe and the rest of the world as allies.
Be careful that one day it really isn’t “with us or against us” … and you realise everybody is against you.
I cannot fathom how much loss you and your countrymen have had to endure. I can only offer prayers and my sincere condolences on your loss.
ReplyDelete